Need help for explanation

[unclhien]

As Xenophanes recognized as long ago as the sixth century before Christ, whether or not God made man in His own image, it is certain that man makes gods in his. The gods of Greek mythology first appear in the writings of Homer and Hesiod, and, from the character and actions of these picturesque and, for the most part, friendly beings, we get some idea of the men who made them and brought them to Greece.

But ritual is more fundamental than mythology, and the study of Greek ritual during recent years has shown that, beneath the belief or skepticism with which the Olympians were regarded, lay an older magic, with traditional rites for the promotion of fertility by the celebration of the annual cycle of life and death, and the propitiation of unfriendly ghosts, gods or demons. Some such survivals were doubtless widespread, and, prolonged into classical times, probably made the substance of Eleusinian and Orphic mysteries. Against this dark and dangerous background arose Olympic mythology on the one hand and early philosophy and science on the other.

In classical times the need of a creed higher than the Olympian was felt, and Aeschylus, Sophocles and Plato finally evolved from the pleasant but crude polytheism the idea of a single, supreme and righteous Zeus. But the decay of Olympus led to a revival of old and the invasion of new magic cults among the people, while some philosophers were looking to a vision of the uniformity of nature under divine and universal law.


From Sir William Cecil Dampier, A Shorter History of Science, ©1957, Meridian Books.

Hi could you please take a look at the passage. It uses overly difficult words.
I don't get the gist of the second paragrph. Can you explain what the paragraph 2 mean ?

_ What does "But ritual is more fundamental than mythology" mean ?
_ What does "belief or skepticism" mean ? Is "skepticism" modifying "belief" ? I can't see any relation between these 2 words.
_ Why can "celebrate the cycle of life and death" or "propiation of ghost" encourage people to have children (promotion of fertility) ? What's the circle of life and death ?
Thanks for your help.

[bschuess]

Hi could you please take a look at the passage. It uses overly difficult words.
I don't get the gist of the second paragrph. Can you explain what the paragraph 2 mean ?

_ What does "But ritual is more fundamental than mythology" mean ?
_ What does "belief or skepticism" mean ? Is "skepticism" modifying "belief" ? I can't see any relation between these 2 words.
_ Why can "celebrate the cycle of life and death" or "propiation of ghost" encourage people to have children (promotion of fertility) ? What's the circle of life and death ?
Thanks for your help.

First, I'm not surprised you have trouble with this writing section. It's dreadful!

In Buddhism, the stories of the gods are the "mythology", but the lighting of incense and bowing to the altars is "ritual".


The second paragraph compares the power of ritual (ceremonies) with the power of mythology (stories and images of the gods). Previously, much has been written about Greek mythology, and this author points to recent research that points out that older, more fundamental rituals persisted into the classical Greek period when the gods were worshiped. It suggests that there is something very primal about such ceremonies and that they were incorporated into peoples religious practices even as religion became more "advanced".


What does "But ritual is more fundamental than mythology" mean ?

So, yeah, he says that ritual affects us in a more primitive, emotional way than religious imagery. It's really like a comparison between the emotional and the intellectual, and I think emotions are more fundamental.

What does "belief or skepticism" mean ? Is "skepticism" modifying "belief" ? I can't see any relation between these 2 words.

"Skepticism" means "doubt" or "uncertainty" about something, so here it is contrasted with "belief". Some people believe the myths and some people are skeptical. So the author is saying that whether people were believers or skeptics, beneath that issue lay the ritual or "older magic" regarding many important questions.

Why can "celebrate the cycle of life and death" or "propiation of ghost" encourage people to have children (promotion of fertility) ? What's the circle of life and death ?

The "circle" of life and death is just a symbolic way of viewing the fundamental question of life and death. It views birth and death as similar to the cycle of the seasons. These are the questions that are addressed by religion (myth and ritual). I think that "Propitiation" of unfriendly ghosts, etc. is given as a separate issue addressed by or arising from the ritual, and not part of the fertility ritual.

I'm not sure that there shouldn't also be a comma between "fertility" and "by". In that case, the author lists three elements of the "old magic" that lived on after the myth of the gods was developed (fertility, circle of life and death, and the ghosts, etc.).

Otherwise, "celebration of the circle of life and death" might be used to encourage fertility by relating it to the eternal cycle of birth and death. Remember, ritual and myth are "magic", not "science" or "logic". It doesn't have to make sense.

I hope this helps. This isn't easy stuff for even a university educated English speaker to read!

[unclhien]

Thanks bschuess, actually I don't fully understand the passage, but I understand each sentence alone. So I want to thank you for your help.

[lifelearnervn]

Can anyone help me explain the meaning of this quotation?
“It is only when we forget all our learning that we begin to know.”
~ Henry David Thoreau quotes (American Essayist, Poet and Philosopher, 1817-1862)
Thank you!:)

[sgcrawf]

Can anyone help me explain the meaning of this quotation?
“It is only when we forget all our learning that we begin to know.”
~ Henry David Thoreau quotes (American Essayist, Poet and Philosopher, 1817-1862)
Thank you!:)
That's kind of a hard one to describe in words. It's similar to a Zen koan.

[Geoffrey]

Can anyone help me explain the meaning of this quotation?
“It is only when we forget all our learning that we begin to know.”
~ Henry David Thoreau quotes (American Essayist, Poet and Philosopher, 1817-1862)

Thoreau is trying to shake us up with this thought. On the surface, he presents a contradiction. How can we possibly know anything after forgotting all our learning? Only when we dig below the surface can we see with his eyes. There are certainly several ways to view this statement, some more obvious than others, some deeper, and some more appealing.

Perhaps the easiest perspective might be to consider the "expert". In our case here, in being experts in our mother language (whether English or Vietnamese) we might say we have forgotten all those lessons we first took as children to learn that language. But now, after much learning, we are fluent and proficient in it. We simply know the language we speak, even though we have all probably forgotten most of the lessons we took to acquire it during our childhoods.

Or think of the expert doctor facing a complicated case. After many years of practice, she can see the patient's illness and the required course of treatment with little effort. The expert doctor knows her trade. But ask her to explain the steps she made to reach her diagnosis and, as likely as not, she will not so easily explain why she knows what she knows. On the other hand, the intern doctor fresh from med school will be able to explain in rigorous details the steps the expert took in forming the diagnosis, but will not on her own be confident to make the diagnosis for many complicated situations. So here the expert knows but cannot remember her lessons, whereas the novice can recall her lessons perfectly but does not confidently know how to solve any but trivial conditions.


Geoffrey
From Brisbane, Australia